2nd 2024 happy New Year uh there are two items on the agenda first of these is continued discussion regarding the internal audit program let's go to that all right then you change Playing Fields all right uh it's about the same but a little more deta develop okay uh I worked off the other one uh what I thought we'd do is just go through it space by space the first of these I know we've been talking about a charter and it it may just be me but I would rather call it a protocol because really when I think about a charter citizens Charter a chartered the city and so we're not we're citizens but we're not that group chartering a new thing it's it's the correct word usage but I would just be but having a charter inside a charter doesn't make sense to me logically what do you guys think is it is it an ordinance is it a resolution it would be a protocol to me what is it I'm asking policy yeah that by resolution okay okay yeah I I agree but I think it's confusing to call it Charter and when we have a charter because everyone thinks that oh the citizen should have to vote on it because that's how our Charter Works um so yeah if we can say policy or what do we call you and darl what are your positions they're employment contracts they we don't have departmental policies uh okay oh I can see where it would be confusing um to have a charter within a charter but just as if professional practice it is typically referred to as an internal audit Charter like OU I don't know about Oklahoma City but you know it is in the profession as internal audit referred to as a charter so but I can see where it would be confusing so what I'm what I'm seeing is the audit the internal audit Charter is not so much implemented into city law more than it is presented on the city's website page as an internal you have the internal audit page and then the internal auditor or officing internal audit uh page site would basically have the internal Charter on in a charter on yeah I it's just it's just a word let's let's change it to policy or protocol what does Oklahoma City's Charter Charter they have a charter I mean every internal audit Department within in every organization has needs a charter in order to operate in order to exist as a profession so this is in in this language is industry standard yes that is standard I'm only presenting anything I just IND standard I mean so then in that vein then I'd rather it be similar to every other yeah working that's my goal is to make it so uniform that it turn it's turn but it will still be adopted by resolution yes it is um policy and procedure will be adopted by resolution um the creation of the audit committee would also be adopted by okay then I'm for keeping it as Charter and we just will have to do some a stage name give it a stage name yeah on the website or something and talking to people particularly they they they're quoting ordinance to me and they're saying this is in the charter no it's not the charter it's an that's an ordinance and so sometimes it's not even that so so Council it sounds like an opportunity for some Civic IQ uh where um Shakira may be able to work closely with Tiffany M to kind of do some podcas yeah some that would be perfect to do some spots just to let the community know and that the community can also go to these other organizations and find very similar documentation so it just provides Comfort to the community what they're what they're seeing it works as long as we're hopefully in there uh the next thing would be on in your whereas the office of the city auditor was established as a Division I would say as an employee the city the there are divisions underneath the Departments here and so that put you at a level that you're not more than anything it be an employee of the council um adopting the position of the city auditor um what do we call charer on May 24th we did that that's when voter was that the date of the charter Amendment oh got it Governor approved it I think okay I I just it didn't ring any bells um then going down to the next St I have a question um it's okay um so if we're going to build out Personnel underneath Shakira Underneath this position does it have to be a division like does the language matter here I think Department's probably the Lang language that's in the charter and it would be like the legal departments the easiest I think so is that what we're saying change it to Department department or something but not a division yeah okay and that uh uh I usually think of a division as a division of a department right yeah we have divisions within department so that's I guess my my organization a bit confused because it was formed under the office City c internal order no it's actually under counsel under councel but city clerk is Administrative is yeah I administer council's budget okay and so that's why your time time sheets thank you definitely that' be a real thank you very much yeah uh all right I don't want that I know that on notice how fast she was to get no no no uh and I've got a question about it it says in here that uh in compliance with laws regulations Etc we don't have regulations do we don't we have ordinance and uh and procedure or is am I picking it straws yeah I think a little bit picking it straws there our ordinances are our laws but it might be referring to applicable state and federal laws depending on the okay the audit being conducted that's fine um then down to whereas the independence and public accountability of the city auditor auditor should be assured by provision of council right appointed City uh Council appointed City auditor instead of legislatively okay and then uh now therefore for it be resolved the end of that second sentence on that the audit Charter for the office I would call a position of the city auditor or the department of Department of that would work all right oh and before we start on the next part of it we have to design this in in our minds how are we thinking about this committee the way that that the audit committee is going to start up in here but everything if we don't start now to design that audit Comm we can't get to it my thought of the audit committee would be the finance committee and any other people on Council that want to be there Shakira will mention in here we're not there yet Shakira will mention in here that it's it's it's it's quite an elegant solution to to a council but it also includes uh members of the public that they'll come in we'll invite them in like we would a committee so we don't do that on any other committees and do we really want to do that do we have to do that by again it'll come back to your Professional Standards do we want how do we want to design this committee I would say just the finance committee well it does say in here that it's two council members three at large at large has to beate qualifications it's very that was just example so it's it's ideal for someone with accounting oil experience chair and then have three or four five other members a couple of those being community at large but it could be uh I guess modified in any way as long as there's city council and U members of the public on the committee now the finance committee I I too was very um interested in possibly that time of Dublin as an audit committee with a a um Community member uh so I'm I'm all for it sure well it's it's the Committee Member that that can we put Francisco on it no there so no City no manager and no director we may be a okay and just staff but not on the committee okay so I I understand the thought process behind doing you know having an audit committee but I do think it probably would be best suited to be under the finance committee because even trying to get you know volunteer at large members throughout the community I will tell you it will be extremely difficult to get a licensed professional such as myself to volunteer to serve on this committee and previously being an internal audit sometimes you do come across some very sensitive information that really should be not publicly displayed right so so without a quorum of council members in the finance committee Catherine could they meet behind closed doors so like if there was a sensitive item can we go into executive session the challenge is we have adopted a resolution and we've adopted an ordinance that says any Committee subcommittee of the council or created by the council has to call the open meeting act so only Clos doors if there's an executive session qualifying item um the other piece of that I mean we could look at changing that and just allowing this committee to to operate separately with less than a form of council potentially but the open meeting act also deals with um it also defines public bodies pretty broadly if you're dealing with expenditure of public funds so Catherine um I I would say the the resolution that adopted that framework was obviously before the community approved the position of the internal auditor and as there's generally accepted accounting principles are there generally accepted audit principles that because Oklahoma City has has a an audit committee that I'm sure we we need to set it up like they've already set it up and liveed through that they're able to discuss sensitive matters without it being on the front page of the newspaper until it's ready um so we may want to drill into a little bit how Oklahoma City addresses those sensitive issues and then formulate that in yeah because our resolution is so broad for us we don't really worry much about what the open meeting act says in terms of what doesn't qualify because everything does here um so I would want to look at that language too to be sure exactly how that you know expenditure of public funds qualifying language would work in this instance so with with that instance um auditing and investigation reports are made public through the website the woman website city um so but then we would have to educate whoever's on the committee that is public that whatever information is being discussed or they're guiding me on that they're aware that this shouldn't become public until the investigation and order is complete and and and if if there was something criminal or something I I think the public has a good right to know how its money spent 100% on that if we have a criminal act or a maybe it's not even up to that level but a poor act I think we'd want to release that very gently through either legal or or whatever there's a comment in here later on that that you go the but I'd let I'd let legal do it first we'll get to that and so what we're thinking in in in my oh I'm sorry oh okay I just have questions about um if this is the finance committee and then you're adding people to it which I the last time we talked about it at Finance was this would be quarterly yes so it wouldn't be every month it would just be every 3 months basically um but what I heard too is that there couldn't be a quorum of council and to date we allow anybody anybody to come any of the you know committees and so would we be excluding council members from being able to have conversations within the finance committee because so is it like the first ones that show up or the like how are we like that gives me pause and concern because we're allowed to be at all of the other committees and so like changing this one to be separate and kind of excl exclusionary for council members to be able to participate I don't love that um so I'm thinking and I like I understand what you're saying about people but it seems like yeah I think that it seems like having a standalone committee with a couple of council members that are chosen to serve on that committee as well as some members like you have it kind of set up here does make a lot of sense and I'm assuming that that's also what Oklahoma City is doing um and so they found a practice that works well for their Community um so yeah I maybe it would be better if there's an executive session like I I'm interested in figuring that out with Finance but um yeah I just don't want one Committee of councel I don't to operate separately and differently than the others I would be might be easier to find people since it's only every three months yeah only four times a year and and and did you want to get sorry mostly I was just curious about executive session and like you'd be meeting four times a year that it would seem most of it could be open or is are we talking the whole meeting is sensitive and would need to not be public or is it part of the meeting would be public and then the extra so as the city auditor I would be taking direction or guidance from the audit committee as far as I guess audits to take or take uh possible allegations that they may have heard um I don't think all of I don't think city council as a whole is um excluded from the meetings I as far as participating that's one thing but excl excluding as far as your attendance and being there I don't think they excluded because again I have to as an internal audit I have to present to audit committee Council and city manager uh just for the efficiency of the operations uh Etc but I don't I don't think that will beud could and just to make it like livable From council's perspective because I know you all want one more meeting um to to be able to facilitate the agenda for the audit committee to be you have the finance committee meeting it concludes you adjourn and then you convene as the finance committee immediately following separate agenda separate Rules of Engagement potentially maybe based on what Oklahoma City does and so it's it's one of those Thursdays when people who are already participating already have it blocked off on their calendar and we don't add another meeting to another date on your calendar I think we can make it very efficient that way that would provide the you know the most number of participants possible and that's that's that's doable I guess I I looking at Oklahoma City's organization Oklahoma City's eight times larger than we are some some number in there and uh as I look at that they they need to be more sophisticated to use us work uh than than I think we do in this I think it's easier to grow a um Department up to that standard than it is to break it down afterwards because then in that why are you guys doing that kind of a thing I think starting off as simply as we can doing breaking up the agenda does that real easily it's it's a clean split we just move meetings kind of a thing and start off simply and then as we say because in in reading the ballot language we talking about this this morning ballot language says to hire an auditor and it infers if I'm right that that there'll be help for the auditor it doesn't say that we're going to build a build a department basically so I I don't know what that means I don't know what what they they they meant by that she obviously needs an assistant of some sort everybody does everybody's going to get sick everybody needs a backup and so in in trying to keep it simple trying to keep it as as just the finance committee doing that the finance committee does include all of counsel and and and I mean there's no every committee does that way we're staying kind of fat a flatten level without getting elegant yet when we when we need see the need that we need have to go to something more complicated then we we just change the resolution that's that's an easy thing to do yes ma'am Katherine do any other committees ever go into executive session no executive sessions are very limited so um I pulled up the statutory provision employment hiring promotion demotion of an employee negotiations with employee groups purchase or appraisal of real property confidential Communications between the public body and its attorney pending concerning a pending investigation claim or action uh and then several other things that don't really apply to cities but an executive session would not be allowed to discuss audit findings unless and you know and I'm not on the committee and not shouldn't be but I would have to come in and say this needs to be confidential because it's a p claim or investigation and that's and my advice is that we need to be an executive session under the statute so there potentially two different types of you know Auto reports or presentations so hypothetically situation one is um Shakira goes in and audits the department of it just for you know policies procedures and we can go through you know the findings recommendations easy peasy conversely we have situation B where she discovered fraud somebody's been embezzling money so that you know but that's not if that could trigger an investigation but that's not something you bring committee anyway I'm talking please um so that's could that then contr or qualify as a situation where you know we have this investigation because she found fraud by an employee yeah okay yes in that Cas yeah those are the types of sensitive items that she may or may not find but just like the routine departmental hey I audited this department here's findings here's recommendations yeah no big deal um sorry um but no I agree we should do what you said I mean the have the basic committee that way we're not looking for new people to fill it and most of the stuff on the committee looking at this isn't something that's going to be confidential and require an executive session I think we're kind of now I I wasn't aware that if you find something you know fraud waste or abuse you immediately go to the audit committee I proba you would go to city manager legal so you would immediately call like a special session then not a special session but a meeting to um let them know the allegations the findings uh and then possibly get guidance on where I should go not that I don't know but as far as procedure with the norm um but we it would be more of a special meeting we we wouldn't wait three months to no no you would not so it would be basically calling a special meeting and then we could make that it basically be this is my PR PR preliminary findings um and I'm I'm seeking to uh open an investigation so so in that scenario if since the finance committee does meet monthly if if the audit committee met and we wouldn't anticipate three more months but she found something in between that the very next finance committee meeting we could agend audit committee to meet immediately following the finance committee's meeting and you're never more than weeks away from your next opportunity frankly if it was Dire it it wouldn't we could we could absolutely call a special session if the world we had to do it we could Tuesday would be best yes ma'am so basically the only instance we would ever go in executive session is and I'll pick on Shan O because he's gone like shir's like Shan O use that credit card all the time sort of thing like if it's naming a person and there would be like a HR consequence employment type consequence that's the only reason for executive session yeah and we'd look at each of those individually just to make sure we're do everything correctly situ yes ma'am question um so as we and I understand about you know Council and the having it separate like I think that that is um you know a possible easier solution to do that um is there a specific reason that it would be helpful um to have citizens serving on this committee and if we exclude that having those positions for you know citizens at large should be on an audit committee um what are we missing like what is the benefit or that is the benefit of that is public accountability or accountability to the public so to involve at large members who are professional Auditors or accountants uh just makes the the decision making process a little more fair a little more transparent a little more accountable um to the public for for instance just you know it's all count City Council Members so uh every audit I may have may look like I'm being you know told to go here there and there but if there's public people on it it's like no this is a fair thing um the public says yes city council says yes they agree yeah I mean and I think too I could be inferring this into why the public voted for us to create an internal AIT position but I think that is what they were looking for was the accountability um for the public um and to be able to kind of have these discussions and have someone that is running these Audits and kind of looking for you know different things over and over um so that's in the spirit I think of what we intended um so don't necessarily want to lose that element let's just say it now who picks these uh community members because that is a blood bath um with Council so like who who picks them wonderful city manager and Council well we'll have a committee in a year okay you and that was my thing I I agree with you council member Schuler that we have to be able to get this information out we have to have everybody when you post it on a website it's it's out to the public we were elected to make sure that we spend the people's money correctly my opinion that's one of the things we are to do if we sit down and we goof that up we find out that I'm doing something I'm I'm influencing somebody to spend money illegally or something it should be public information and and and it should be immediate but all of us are held accountable every two or three years depending on the term uh for what we we did in in that if we have a person that is we pick it's a pretty hard you guys are pretty rare uh Birds when when it comes down to looking for somebody who's actually qualified to understand exactly at the depth that you do we're lucky to have you on here now so as we sit down there and look at that how are we going to be able to replace you without having a blood B and I thought about that for hours and I have not come up with a solution because every time you're going to that we get into personality product can we draw names out of a hat that is how it's been done council members have been drawn from a hat Council agrees Shakira can kind of give you uh Insight on the the resume of those individuals whose names would go in the Hat um it it wouldn't matter From staff's perspective which name you drew out if they met that qualification probably the more random better literally out of the Hat I'm not joking normally I joke but I'm not joking about this like if you could narrow down the most qualified for how long a term would you pull these people true isn't it written in there it's like in staggered terms yeah it has five I think people in there andbody kind of leaves and and and we that's doable it's not my favorite but it's doable it it does make it transparent enough I just think a lot of the transparency comes off of the off of what's posted on the website everything that's not confidential should be post on the website so that people can see you know how did we spend money on motel hotel hotel motel tax uh and and who collect it has it g how' it get in there most of us are not going to read that stuff does you know we want the summary at the top please yeah we collected it correctly l or we got it all correctly so anyway um are we done with that part of the conversation okay right there next thing I I if you'll explain to me a a sentence this is over here under Section Five Independence and objectivity and uh second to last sentence in there says the city auditor will confirm to the audit committee and the city council at least annually the organizational Independence of the internal audit activity that doesn't make sense to me so basically I have to confirm that I'm independent oh um every year uh independent of basically US influence coer right so basically I have to in writing say what committees I'm a part of or say um yeah what groups I'm a part of and that I can't audit them to maintain my in uh things like that it's just a statement of I'm I'm free and clear there's no conflict of interest there's no biasness 100% with it I just didn't understand the sentence organizational Independence didn't make sense that's all right um I have some grammar things umt to say from you it's okay go ahead go ahead and there are some more I I've made some some things that I would change but they're they're not they're not uh the whole thing about audit report uh when we're sitting down here in 10 audit reports the the last sentence that that comes from this uh it says the city auditor shall notify the Cleveland County district attorney I would add in there at the direction of council under the advisement of City attorney AG yeah it just I couldn't and just put that but I couldn't necessarily go in liais on or do anything with the Cleveland County uh yay my legal G to go to Catherine first anyway and and and and and do he's a nice guy but I don't where were you at I was that was under 10 bottom of page four bottom yeah okay it's like the last sentence last sentence I've got do you want a a copy of my scratching oh I actually have one yeah okay you gave me that uh that's that the the other things are in uh uh going on in there are some things in here that I think are part of of finances deal if we go to audit committee which is 12 it' be my page 7 of eight uh thei conducting overseeing the requests Etc in there that's finance that looks to me like Finance committee's job uh it says uh uh conducting overseeing the request for proposal and selection process for the firm conducting the annual financial statement Audits and that would Finance does historically yeah yes but in terms of you want to move them over to you no no no in terms of audits I I may very well be um auditing Finance sure so as far as I guess them completing the RFP process for documents I would need kind of cre working water so um I've uh in my experience I've just always had a legal U professional dealing so I've always well I've been um forwarding my request to Catherine and Anthony sure and it it just overseeing that is absolutely not a problem it it would just be it looked to me like you were going to do the rfps for the for the process so oh well no so in law we would give the list of documents into a lawyer Ada they will do a subpoena or RFP um in this situation we don't have any subpoena Towers right not right so I've just um for one of the investigations I'm conducting right now uh Catherine and Anthony were able to write the RFP for that inv got because it's investigation I don't want necessarily to include other departments and the knowledge of you know orders that other departments are going through so just to keep and that other I think that's more for getting information for audits yes versus selecting the the external auditor that's the way I understood selecting that auto I don't know Anthony's pretty big I don't want him coming after me one of my things in life any other thoughts from anybody else on on this document only to ahead marked we already went over so oh good we agree uh I think I think it's one it's just toning down figuring out where we are and and getting things in there uh making progress making progress trying to get things are we going to try to have the first meeting after the first quarter of this year but how how how quickly are you ready to start presenting to a committee sign up the committee so I am currently writing um the internal audit policy and procedure manual for the internal um and then I'm also building a risk assessment uh process Excel I have my risk assessment questionnaires completed so it's just about I guess getting this the governance situated and I can take off I'm just I'm kind of waiting to take off so I'm on T it doesn't have to be January March June I mean it could be February could be the initial because I'm like do you want to wait until this fiscal year is ended and then you've audited it and then you first meet with the committee in September or are you how far back are you going in audits what fiscal year I guess are you starting with the audits I'm starting with the most recent FY 24 okay um I will probably go back uh to my experience is five years okay as far as the statute limitation fraud and things like that if there if I was to find something uh but as far as a audit plan I would like for the audit plan to span three years I know that you put um three years on the thing but I really I I want to do an annual report of the threeyear Roll plan yes so it'll be every three years I'm presenting a new audit plan but every year I'll be presenting updates on what was done what needs to be done was to be completed um so with that I would like to have an audit plan by the summer okay that's it's so you want to go after the after this fiscal's done yeah then I would like to present a comprehensive risk based audit plan so so in that timetable so let's let's think June is maybe June finance committee um that those at large members with the background that shiran outlines uh council could all have a copy of what that background is make contact with your constituents who may meet that criteria and prepare for the drawing of the names maybe at a May finance committee meeting so in June th the individuals could could be invited and be on the agenda to start rocking and rolling if that June finance committee okay yeah and if we don't find a person to draw out of the hat or we have two people well two two give us a choice there you go one's a choice so okay I that works we can facilitate all that thank you for your work it's it's not easy setting up a division thank you for the opportunity yeah I plan to put the notch on my so on this timeline I was just looking at the review and approval the internal audit Charter is reviewed at least annually by the audit committee so we're starting the committee in June when are they reviewing the charter May or June right off the bat you want if there's any updates needed um with Trends or things that are happening within the city they want to change ad or delete I guess that kind of makes sense if it's running alongside the fiscal year yes exactly that's that's exactly what I wanted to kind of start the start the audit plan when the year starts fiscal year starts that makes sense that's a lot of work to get done but excited yeah I too it it it'll be it's a good thing uh as you say it's it's a way of being able to prove that we're spending the money correctly and efficiently I'm not I'm not sure who said it but someone said the public eluded or they felt like the public internal auditor that was C sh yes is there anything that was like Stephen what was said that night wasn't it what happened that night wasn't a recommendation of former council member Robert Castleberry who is also a CPA he recommended doing this and so then it went to the uh our Charter Review Committee and they also it was a citizen committee recommended that they put forward a charter amendment to create the position he see something or no he just said best practice chair of the finance committee yeah a few years he was on Council for six years so thank you foral council member you'll you'll probably see his name in a hat his name will be in a hat it's coming it's going to be you know he's g go for on but not internal but oh his hat his name can't be hat it could be he my guess is he would meet that criteria if it's been a year since he served it's been several what was the professional criter yeah he's a CP 2019 I think Allison came on y oh yeah so he's he's clear free and clear hopefully so far he's out of jail uh item number two discussion on Cleanup in downtown normal so we're going to talk trash with Michelle I love hey Michelle happy New Year Happy New Year to you talk trash let's do talk trash so I want to preface what I'm going to talk about very quickly with the fact that I can't sit you know me that we got these responses Friday at 4: so this is a cursory look from this morning okay it sprinkled in throughout my rest of my day that a lot to do okay so with that let's go on um here's the background so I added a little history uh of the litter crew most people didn't really understand where it came from or how it started you know it was this it was that well I found the original memo October 2002 Doug Danner wrote it yeah to get a litter crew which is fantastic and so the original allocation and that's also the year that my youngest son was born and that month say uh the original allocation was $71,000 and that was in 2002 for four person 215 days that's about 3/4 of the year to do cleanup they were also tasked though with doing the Mowing and cleaning out the debris from the channels so that was interesting I didn't know that um in 2008 it went away because there was a downturn and things got cut pretty dramatically from what I could tell in the records uh but in 2008 Greg Hall who was your streets and storm water superintendent brought it back um and it was 48,000 both of those came from the general fund it was a public works um program Endeavor uh and then in 2017 Council went ahead and approved Our Lake Thunderbird tmdl plan the monitoring and compliance plan and that's where we included uh the litter control as part of uh the tmdl bnps that we're going to do the best management practices that we were going to do to make it better so that's where that came from and what I've done here is the top map uh it's kind of hard to see but this was the 2008 map 2008 2009 map and what you can see is that long red line that goes out that's Alam and the the one partial Street there is 12 so that's all they did was pretty much what we would consider or I would consider urbanized core Norman area uh the below is the 201822 and 2022 map you can see that well it's hard to tell but I'm going to tell you that aside from our just cleaning in the creeks and streams along here just in our major streams uh most of the cleanup was along streets and roadways ditches um within the Thunderbird Watershed again ties into what I was saying about the team deal the SOP for the actual litter crew was included in the 2019 policy manual that you guys adopted uh when we were trying to get a utility and bond past so this is what we talked about this is why we got to where we are litters increasing we have uh people in our community that would benefit from having a low barrier employment opportunity Boom the RFP right Oklahoma City does it Tulsa does it so uh the content this is what we asked for we wanted them to have a a day wage for beautifying our city but also have wraparound Services provided so Access to Health Care Mental Health housing permanent employment that kind of thing um and this is what we offered to provide funding for the program Notch right the van the crossover van um and then assistance with the litter disposal we'd also weigh it because that's a great metric to have I'm just saying uh and then program oversight right there could be changes with negotiations so that's what we talked about we issued the RFP November 17th deadline was last Friday uh and then this is the perceived or proposed timeline if we continue so what did we do we got two responses to responses we got one from the Mental Health Association of Oklahoma they're the ones who run the better way in Oklahoma City and Tulsa um then we also got one from Norman Caravans you guys are familiar with them as well they're a local nonprofit here that provides the transportation services for unhoused members of our community the range of cost was 330,000 and some change at the bottom end to 530,000 and some change at the top end uh the difference difference between those two numbers uh the lower end is working 3 days a week um with 8 to n participants the higher end is 5 days a week um so that's that's what we got originally we had the allocation for the litter crew of $50,000 so this is substantially different from that you need to know that and just you know in the the reason this conversation began um Mr O who used to oversee the litter Crew He said you know $50,000 isn't buying us what it used to so what they 215 days back in 2002 it just got paired down as far as the dollars went he said we're down to like 90 days and we're not getting it done anymore so I would propose in the upcoming budget we increase that number and I said pick a number where you think you could actually have an impact and he said probably in the $150,000 range y so um the ability to employ a targeted population and provide some wraparound Services probably accounts for what we're seeing in in part of that it wasn't that wasn't what we used to do it's a thing that Council says we we would like to do we can absolutely make that happen in my ongoing conversation with Michelle and Chris uh Chris cringes when I say we're picking up litter why is this not a solid waste function and we do recognize that in in Michelle's oversight we wouldn't want to provide a service paid for uh with solid waste funds in certain neighborhoods where in other neighborhoods we would force the property owner to do that work out of their own pocket and it seems like we may wind up with a solution where it's partially general fund funded and partially Solid Waste funded uh with Michelle selling Chris's oversight uh just to make sure that that the stuff that really is the public benefit get the general funds paying for and and the stuff that's the specific benefit Solid Waste would pay for those pieces but we'd be able to track what letter we're picking up we'd be weighing it and if they're putting it in Orange bags and we're picking up the bags we would know whose mess it was to pick up so um I I think we are learning a lot I'm glad Michelle went back to the beginning of the program because it was educational for all of us to recognize we've been doing it a long time we're talking about doing it bigger and better and having better outcomes for those that we hire and uh better outcomes for a cleaner Norman at the end of the day and the cool thing about my division as Mr P pointed out is that it actually is funded from both utility money and from general fund so they did we have a number on how many people would employ 8 to nine8 to nine yes ma'am is that a rotating cast or would it be the same FKS depends so cursory look at the rfps I'm Sorry Miss Grant cursory look at the rfps um shows that they're a little different in the makeup and has you know one of them has a little bit of a flexible thing and one doesn't so I really it's require an in depth valuation a lot of this comes about from discussions on two things concern me one's L downtown the other stuff's getting stuff in the Creeks The Creeks are horrible with Walmart bags and stuff awful stuff we have uh L problems downtown everything from normal trash to to human waste to other things that just don't need to be here we there isn't a solution if there were a business district downtown that would take care of that they would tax those people to do that we weren't successful in getting that done uh we'll try again but right now now we we need to do something that we can do positively for everybody and and I know on here we we're talking downtown but downtown to me means everywhere we need it it's it's it's Norman if we need to go out to your ward to clean up along 12 that's not downtown but that needs cleaning and that's what I would hope Mr hia and Council that you guys would consider is that um absolutely we should help uh make our community look beautiful for our visitors and our workers absolutely but we also need to um address our water quality issues since we have um we've got Parks maintenance people out in the field every day we have Solid Waste Crews all over town every single day we have lots of eyes on the community and if they recognize oh my gosh you know something fell off the back of a truck in some neighborhood and there's just trash everywhere the ability to say let's direct that crew over to this neighborhood this morning and and pick up that specific mess we'll have the ability to be flexible and very responsive just based on the number of City and Norman employees who are out looking and see these things and can radio it in and make a call I think we'll be able to solve a lot of those immediate problems um but this is all like public like rways obviously Creeks so if it's on HOA property or gated community like we currently would not be able to pick up trash on private property because we're publicly funded but I will def to the she's exactly right I mean that's that's something we're going to have to to address I'm sure and you know what we do now is if our crews are out and they see trash blown into uh a creek bed or or area where they um where they have control and access and and it's their property then we're making phone calls to try and get them to go clean that up and that would not change I wouldn't think under this we've got a be careful because we're using rate payer funds that were not benefiting individual private property owners to see with the data that you would be giving DEQ about weighing all this uh what do you what benefits do you think would come from that like knowing where who's got like the most litter all the time or well for sure no I will give you that so that's kind of the excitement for me is having data cuz we have a phenomenal GIS team oh my God they're phenomenal and they'll put whatever we want in a layer this way yeah absolutely we can find out where we have the issues where are those open dumps or areas that we need to constantly come back to what are some controls we can do in those areas to make it so it's not so much maybe we can put a sign maybe it's a signage maybe it's a an access control maybe it's something else and then we don't have to come and clean up that area all the time all right thanks um so darl if you feel comfortable with this in your budget then I'm in favor of proceeding with the program well I would say okay for which budget because you know chis and and I would say at least I'm going to I'm pretty loyal you will see that in me and utilities is my home we're broke we're trying we're trying solid if it's going to be funded partially General and then solid ways like and and we're good at we have we're we're really we're truck drivers is what our group is we don't have a lot we moved to the side card pickup to get rid of soft tear tissue claims back at the city automation you know so we're kind of moved more in that business we will sometimes hire the Temporaries to help in picking up the trash but we always are there for like volunteers that go to parks and clean it up if they'll get it in bags or get it we'll set a dumpster we we totally accommodate that we'll come pick it up go take it dump it pay for all that but we're just not good at really being out there either managing people to pick it up or picking it up we're we're better at driving the trucks and and then the budget yeah we're tight I'll have to go ask for more money we are doing a um cost of service study right now with Rift Tellis on our sanitation and and what we're going to have them do is find out who's paying into the sanitation fund and who's benefiting and we're going to rebalance and make sure it's fair because we don't want residential subsidizing commercial and we don't want commercial subsidizing residential so we're going to have those numbers for you probably within about three months well if you're gonna ask for more money I know guy I know so the my next steps you can see I'm sorry yeah are just you guys want to do it do you don't and then where do we find it so please that's all I have without getting into too many details because I know you can't and the review will be separate um but the budget the 330 or the 530,000 um like we're providing a transportation for them and all maintenance and gas and things so that would not be included in the 330 so is that for them to pay the people or are we going to be doing that like is and just like kind of administrative so primarily what the costs would it look like were the administrative costs and the um paying for the okay so that would be wrapped up in they're paying for it perfect one one makes me feel more comfortable yeah yeah we're not we're not going to be the bosses yeah for um you have two or two companies that answer the proposal so Caravans they work with the homeless and trans Community right who who would they be hiring would they be hiring so for both of both RFP both responses would hire from our in-house Community absolutely oh that's Wonder that's a great initiative and when the way they have it set up are different but they're both going to pull from that right commun okay I'm supportive yeah council member home I'm supportive as well um but part of me wants to do the three days a week to see how it goes and then expand the other part of me says do it five days a week and that way it's a consistent a consistent five days a week job for somebody maybe so and I think it could be a selling point of a future rate increase cuz it's been 2011 12 since the last uh Solid Waste increase so part of a selling point could be that this voter this increase would be for enhanced cleanup clean say yes if you want to yeah cleaner Norman water in addition to regular you know this would be one of the benefits You' be get from this this rate increase would be the water and I my expectation would be pretty much Citywide but yeah I mean like downtown but campus Corner West Lindsay Street Main Street can be that was just where the conversation started especially the places where people are at the most so the city parks yeah and the the you know primary shopping destinations we're upsetting Nash over there you could do a game day Focus you know a Friday Focus Etc and obviously yeah with all the lake lird water [ __ ] a whole lot of w five when the need Rises and we would also think the opportunity to to take advantage of this van and wrap it with the catchy whatever maybe it's the slogan for the next great discussion but so people see it when they see it driving down the road it's not just another white van it is their litter crew making Norman clean put trash man Ru okay trash person trash person you're right Mormon I was going to say I know you can only scroll it cursar but uh did any of them have routes like oh we're going to go to the gym so we're going to go to so what uh one proposal did say we will go to hot spots of um pan handling and that so the other did not say it would go to specific locations it said it would have connections with people in the community and would pre-arrange a location I'll guarantee we can find you some places it's a Target how each of these were approaching uh the populations in question and and Katherine if I'm not mistaken uh if Council Awards a a a contract the ability then to begin negotiating with that respondent and we can kind of fine-tune this this is again this approach is new to us it's being done in other places but yeah I think Council can definitely find comfort in what that final uh approved contract looks like with the service provider on your current timeline that's march to have all that done so we would have the selection process internally and then start negotiating with whoever the successful proposal was that's a lot of work by Mark yeah but I would really all right I have an ulterior motive right um we always celebrate tell you we celebrate Green Norman Eco month right yeah middle of March to middle of may remember so I would love to get it going for that you know yeah as soon as possible yeah break a bottle of just say no she does ready we're ready anything any other questions from Council no feel good thank you man thank you for your time stting stuff I love your trash enthusiasm she's a trashy lady you should have seen her presentation on the Reclamation was it the no it was the one where you take the latest is Maybe good
